epoxy kneeboards?

Poidog · Post by **Poidog** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 8:53 pm

is there such a thing? i have seen
ads on ebay for epoxy surfboards and was wondering if anyone out there had a kb made out of epoxy? if so how does it ride? pros and cons of epoxy kbs.

surfhorn · Post by **surfhorn** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 5:49 am

Surftech makes a 5'6" and 6'0: fish out of tufflite but they are made for stand-ups. I did run into a KBer in Freeline Surf Shop who swears by the 5'6" and was in the process of buying his second one.

I'll have to talk to Randy about coming up with something more akin to a KB - widen the template and definitely look at a wider tail. And go with four fin boxes, maybe five so one could mix and match.

Poidog · Post by **Poidog** » Wed Aug 27, 2003 10:21 pm

hey surfhorn, thanks for the info.
is a epoxy board supposed to be
stronger or lighter than a glassed
board? can you keep me posted on what your friend Randy says or thinks about making a kb out of that tufflite material? thanks...

surfhorn · Post by **surfhorn** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 4:35 am

Epoxy is lighter and is supposd to be tougher than polyesther resin and fiberglass. There are a lot of stand-ups in Santa Cruz switching to epoxy boards, especially now that there is a wide variety of decent shpes to choose from. So far, everyone seems happy.

The Surftech 5'6" and 6'0" fishes are a start but, after looking at today's KB templates, don't offer the the widths needed for all around KBing. The current expoxy fishes remind me of KB designs we rode 10-20 years ago - good in medium size barrels and steeper, down-the-line surfing but not for big 'ol gouging cutbacks and other high perfromance manuevers.

I just talked to my contacts and Santa Cruz Surfboards is coming out with an epoxy 6'0" fish off of a plug shaped by Doug Haut. I'll try and have one or two available as a demo at the November contest here in S'Cruz.

Beeline2.0 · Post by **Beeline2.0** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 8:48 am

surfhorn · Post by **surfhorn** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 9:15 am

Beeline - I fully agree with you. As a KB, the template is really old school and designed off of stand-up boards that Rat Boy rides here in S'Cruz.
What I am going to try to do is talk the company into making something more along the lines of a KB.

But, since the KB market is small and the stand-up market large, I'm not holding my breath. The most we can hope for is a fuller stand-up template.

Bud · Post by **Bud** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 7:16 pm

Good points all.

I've examined a few of the Toughlight and Surftech boards very closely.
Very slick, lightweight and finished pretty well. They seem dent resistant.
But they are brittle.
They are not as indestructible as you'd hope. When they ding they suck water very quickly. I've seen the damage results from some of the hot rats here who have them.

They also can delaminate from being left in the sun too long. This causes bulges on the bottoms and decks as trapped gas in the foam expands under the board's skin.

Then there is a problem of being too light. TOO LIGHT???? Yep that can be a problem.
A board that is too light will not carry itself when projecting turns.
They have to be constantly nursed along.
I've built many fly weight boards and they just lack the vital inertia of a well made balanced light weight board. Around 6 lbs seems just right.
Lighter than that and they just don't follow through or accelerate when you weight and unweight.

As an example I met a guy selling a nearly new Jeff Clark 10'6" Surftech gun. A very beautiful and very light board even at that length. The guy said it paddled great but when he caught the wave (20+ Waimea), the board wouldn't keep going. He nearly died trying to make it work.

Imagine effortlessly catching the meanest wave of your life and your board won't go!

Remember, there's nothing like a "CUSTOM" built kneeboard built by a kneeboarder for kneeboarders.

With that in mind, I remember Eric Shoelkopf had access to the right type of blanks and supplies to build custom epoxy kneeboards and was doing so.
He may still offer them.
That would be the best direction to pursue.

As for myself (Blast Kneeboards), it isn't practical or cost effective to do them.

There are no facilities around that build epoxy boards.
The kneeboard market is too small to allow me to invest the money to gear up for it.

I've looked into having a batch of those epoxy pop out boards done at the same overseas factories making Surftech and Toughlight.

They will build anything, but with a 250 board minimum, which equals an outlay of nearly US$40,000.

I know a few board builders here that use to do a lot of epoxy board building during the windsurfing boom.

They are now "sensitized" to epoxy and can nolonger work with it.
But in Eastern Europe and Thailand or where ever, the different factories are building these new fashionable boards, this isn't an issue. There are no EPA or OSHA type organizations that actually show any concern for the workers.

We all want an everlasting magic board.
But realistically it's not going to happen.

Buying a "custom" foam and fiberglass kneeboard board at US$500 and keeping it 4 years will cost you $00.34 a day.

That's a bargain!

Still want the epoxy kneeboard?
When I get 250 orders for them at one time paid in full, I'll try to arrange it.
SEND MONEY NOW!!!

Don · Post by **Don** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 7:28 pm

Bud,

Great comments. I'm stashing my spare change nightly now!

I still find CUSTOM kneeboards at USD$500 a bargain. You just can't get anything made like this with your specs for this price. This is our passion and getting custom equipment is essential. Thank you! I see a ton of Blast boards in the water here in the SF / SC area and guys charge on your equipment.

Keep up the great work... let the masses go for the epoxy boards... I'm a fiberglass junky (pardon the pun) and bless you and all the kneeboard shapers for putting truly great machines beneath us.

Mark Robertson is charging on his Hybrid Fish... It's a great board for him!

Hope Indo rewarded you appropriately.

Cheers

Steeno · Post by **Steeno** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 7:31 pm

thnx bud
my brother is into racing kayaks and asked me about epoxy surfboards, and said why dont I get a kneelo like that. I knew there were some problems, and you just cleared that up.
cheers

Poidog · Post by **Poidog** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 8:05 pm

to all, thanks for all of your information on this subject of epoxy made kneeboards, its sounds like it would be to much trouble to start & perfect a system of making
epoxy kbs. fiberglass boards have been around forever and im very happy with mine. but it was still
interesting to hear of all the info
that is out there. thanks again guys....

surfhorn · Post by **surfhorn** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 9:07 pm

The epoxy boards are too light for KBing. I invested a lot of time years ago testing out various weight KBs and I always like my boards with some weight to them.

Its a good exercise to look at the options from time to time.

Eric Carson · Post by **Eric Carson** » Fri Aug 29, 2003 5:59 am

Check out Dave Parmaters Manifesto on Surf Tech. http://www.swaylocks.com/cgi-bin/discus ... view=26271
It's loong but well worth the read.
As for me, I'm sticking with proven shapers. I plan to get another Blast or possibly a Parkes.
Greg Loehr is a well known shaper and epoxy guru and I spoke with him at length a few months ago about shaping me an epoxy kb. I went with a Blast instead and have no regrets.

Poidog · Post by **Poidog** » Sat Aug 30, 2003 10:50 am

Eric Carson wrote:Check out Dave Parmaters Manifesto on Surf Tech. http://www.swaylocks.com/cgi-bin/discus ... view=26271
It's loong but well worth the read.
As for me, I'm sticking with proven shapers. I plan to get another Blast or possibly a Parkes.
Greg Loehr is a well known shaper and epoxy guru and I spoke with him at length a few months ago about shaping me an epoxy kb. I went with a Blast instead and have no regrets.

very,very long article but it was great. everything i ever wanted to know about epoxy surfboards. and then some... i moved here(ca.)from kauai, hawaii in 1992 and brought with me my 1 MAGIC board, a 5'10" rnd pin thruster made by peter popler of kilauea. BACKDOOR BOARDS
is still made in his small shapeing room at his house. to all of the small operation BACKYARD shapers out there. thank you for making Real boards.

doc · Post by **doc** » Sun Aug 31, 2003 5:18 am

Eric Carson wrote:As for me, I'm sticking with proven shapers. I plan to get another Blast or possibly a Parkes.
Greg Loehr is a well known shaper and epoxy guru and I spoke with him at length a few months ago about shaping me an epoxy kb. I went with a Blast instead and have no regrets.

Having fixed a few Loehrs and other epoxy boards in my day, I ca't recommend Loehr's approach to epoxy technology. Henry Fry and patagonia/Point Blanks have better foam/epoxy boards, at least from the standpoint of how they are built. The closed cell foam tends to take on water and it takes literally weeks to drain out enough to make them repairable. Also, the closed cell foam ( like styrofoam cooler foam ) tends to discolor and deteriorate.

doc

Nov · Post by **Nov** » Fri Sep 05, 2003 9:04 pm

Is epoxy that stuff that bodyboards are made off? I'd love to get a kneeboard made out of that bodyboard stuff, it would be so light and it would be so easy to do airs on plus on those big crappy onshore closeout days where theres no one out but lids you could paddle out and surf with them easily or has someone already tried this with a board like that and got wasted?

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