catamaran/piclklefork designs

What works & what doesn't and in what type of conditions. Got a "secret" only you and your shaper know???? Post it here... we can keep it quiet ;-)

Moderator: Moderator

User avatar
Bryan Jackson
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Posts: 158
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 12:14 pm

Beeline the faus paux is all yours!

Post by Bryan Jackson »

Ha! Ha! Beeline you are so, so clever with your rather lame attempt at sarcasm/humor :lol: (not).

I only referred to the Gemini as a 'PickleFork' because that is how others often refer to it :wink: . Personally I think Gemini is a much better name.

As for using the word “keel” in reference to the broad based fin of the Steve Lis Fish (a word your previous post used as well! :P ), perhaps you might want to take a look at the article on the Fish design on www.SurferMag.com or better yet, contact Larry Gephart, the inventor of that fin template, and let him know just what a serious faus paux he himself made in applying the word “keel” to his fin design! I’m sure he would be glad to hear from you and make the appropriate corrections (not) :roll: !
willli
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Posts: 286
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 6:18 am
Location: long island, NY

Post by willli »

Ha Ha... Brian and Bee and the Argot(not)s

As for Cortez Bank and the whole tow thing?

Lets see... I'm connected to the electric grid and power plants pollute, and I drive an internal combustion powered car and it pollutes, and I don't have a composting toilet, or solar hot water, and I ride plastic surfboards which in manufacture emit toxic VIO and I have flown on commercial jets which pollute the stratosphere and I have on occasion eaten at McD's and opened a can of tuna but I'm opposed to real fur in clothes and I am a member of Surfrider and (gasp) I live on the East Coast which reaps the polluting benefits of prevailing westerlies passing over every polluting human activity in the country and of course every Cali surfer knows the East doesn't get real waves ... hmmmm ... am I qualified to criticize tow-in surfing?? There's a cruise ship leaving for Alaska maybe I'll sign on and watch the wake of s*** in the open ocean or take a Mentawi boat trip where there are no regs concerning holding tanks or much else!!!

Personally I despise the jet-skis in the surf. But I know a place in Brooklyn that would make 50 tow crews at Cortez look like a nice quiet garden party ... so many hundreds of jet-skis and speedboats driven by open silk shirt gold chain machos cruising the channel at top speed with their bikini clad accessories.. and that's it, no purposeful riding, just being there, cruising. My understanding is these things can be regulated but they aren't going away. I don't see a manufacturer conspiracy to ruin the tranquil world of soul surfing. I see people that buy them to put something in their lives that wasn't there before.

And the powered surfboard. Lets see.. 11 feet long, six and a half inches thick, over 26 inches wide weighing over 80lbs... maybe at Malibu they should be worried? At least one thing is certain, it definitely isn't a cat, a dog maybe, and Miki Dora, wasn't his model "da cat"? Did that have two hulls??
Beeline2.0
Legend (Contribution King!)
Legend (Contribution King!)
Posts: 1873
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2003 9:02 pm

Re: Beeline the faus paux is all yours!

Post by Beeline2.0 »

,,
Last edited by Beeline2.0 on Wed Feb 27, 2008 2:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
DavidW
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Posts: 171
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2003 12:03 pm
Location: san diego

Post by DavidW »

Wow!! great exchanges. Not to stir the pot or the like, but we always refered to the wood "Geppy" fins as keel fins. It made sense to me because the Coice label that Toby/Rich shapes for read Custom Shapes and Hulls.

As for the jet ski/waverunner, when it is too big to paddle into the waves let them go for it. I love to watch those guys riding those comic book sized waves.
That said, tow surfing should not take place when there is a paddle in surfer in the line up.

As kneeboarders we should not cast stones at the way others choose to ride waves. That would be the same as the pot calling the kettle black.
User avatar
Bryan Jackson
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Posts: 158
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 12:14 pm

You can dish it out but you just can't take it!

Post by Bryan Jackson »

Gee Beeline, so sorry to hurt your feelings (not) :P . I guess some people can dish it out but they just can’t take it. The problem with you was I was never sure if you were being serious and wanted to engage in a real discussion/debate regarding board design or just wanted to be a smart-ass! I guess the latter was the case, that is until you got stung by your own little faux paus (BTW it is faux pas, not paus, so I guess you committed yet another faux pas! :lol: ).

As far as the argument that almost any activity we engage in causes pollution to some degree or another so what’s the big deal about PWCs, motorized surfboards, etc., to me that is even more of reason to be circumspect in our activities and try to limit the amount of pollution we create, especially when that pollution directly affects the ocean and/or is the result of our recreational activities :cry: .

Yes our boards are made of rather toxic materials :shock: but there is a strong ongoing effort to research and develop alternative materials that cause less pollution. In addition, once a board has been finished it creates little to no pollution in and of itself :) . Of course if it is destroyed and the materials not properly recycled that is another matter :evil: .

Oh one other thing. Miki Dora’s nickname was “Da Kat” because people compared his graceful moves when surfing to those of a cat and the board design he rode was named “Da Kat” after him, not because of its design parameters.
willli
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Posts: 286
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 6:18 am
Location: long island, NY

Post by willli »

Gee if Bee's skin is thin does that mean you're thick?

And Miki's moves were cat like? Honest? I mean you're certain about this? Gosh us boyz in da east allus taut dat he hab a ting wit da hobie an dat why he da cat ya no two hullllsss n all dat no-sense wit sales n wind, not no dam suff bawd ... sheeeeeeeeet us allus git it rong! I say dis .. all I ebba no is dat I no nuttin. Mus be all dat po lu shun makin my melun hut. dammm.
User avatar
Smokin Rock
Legend (Contribution King!)
Legend (Contribution King!)
Posts: 1068
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2003 12:20 am
Location: downtown Kapaau

Post by Smokin Rock »

well i guess the polish has finally come off the turd. we've gotten over the "honeymoon" period and we're startin to act normal now....frequently at each others throats. pretty entertaining.
"This sucks more than anything that has ever sucked before." Butt-head
User avatar
Bryan Jackson
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Posts: 158
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 12:14 pm

Some info about Miki 'Da Cat'.

Post by Bryan Jackson »

Geez, do I have to do everything for you guys :roll: . A quick search of the internet and I was able to pull the following quotes (below). Although none them directly attribute Miki Dora’s nickname of ‘Da Cat’ to his feline moves while surfing, I think they are substantial enough to back up my claim regarding the origin of that nickname :P . I’m sure more extensive research would turn up a direct quote to this effect. If I really gave a crap I would do this but I don't (give a crap,that is :lol: !).

A few other thoughts:

Although Miki Dora was not a KBer, he was quite an interesting character and probably would made a good KBer 8) .

I could not find a single word about him ever having sailed on a Hobie Cat or picture of him doing so. Although I am not saying he never did, I AM ABSOLUTELY 100% POSITIVE THAT HE DID NOT GET HIS NICKNAME FROM ANY ASSOCIATION WITH THE HOBIE CAT (so there) :twisted: !

For one thing, apparently he already had gained his nickname of ‘Da Cat” by 1957, yet I believe the Hobie Cat was not even invented until the 1960’s :o !

Anyway here is some more info on Miki Dora (1936-2002) with sources.

Mickey Chapin Dora, Miklos S. Dora III, Miki Dora, MSD III. The names are many, and so are the facets of the man they call "Da Cat." Mickey Dora is surfing's Black Knight, the consummate antihero of the Malibu era.

Born in Budapest, Hungary to Miklos and Ramona Dora (who soon divorced), his stepfather, the great surfer Gard Chapin, introduced the boy to the ways of the ocean and a life at the beach. Dora was a worthy student and an excellent test pilot for the surfboard Chapin bought him. "Chapin was one of the few guys who instantly recognized that my pintails would work," surfboard innovator Joe Quigg recalls. "I got ridiculed and (Bob) Simmons laughed at them, but Chapin got one, and he bought one for Mickey, and that was his first surfboard."

Young Dora was a touch iconoclastic from the get-go. His early plan to fire-bomb the shack at San Onofre would have been offensive even to his independently minded stepdad had he carried it out. Stories of Dora's youth abound; stories on his Malibu years and beyond are legend. But Da Cat's outrageous scams, ruses and poses mask a man of extreme sensitivity and brilliance -- in and out of the water.

With the advent of foam surfboards and the more maneuver-oriented surfing styles of the late '50s, Dora's subtle mastery of wave positioning and the nuances of board control set him apart from the pack at Malibu, and his appearances there became the fodder of legend. His deft mannerisms on and off the beach and calculatedly eccentric comings and goings epitomized the Jack Kerouac/James Dean cult of cool. Who knew what lurked behind those Ray Ban sunglasses?

After Gidget created a cinematic genre, Dora became a sometime stunt double for several of the early '60s Hollywood beach flicks beginning with 1964's Muscle Beach Party. He was also worked in Bikini Beach (1964), How to Stuff a Wild Bikini (1965), Beach Blanket Bingo (1965) and Ski Party (1965). He was featured as himself in Bill Delaney's Surfers: The Movie (1990).

In his halcyon days, Dora circulated mysteriously, sometimes penetrated the L.A. scene and lived an increasingly covert existence. Occasional interviews with the nascent surf media were veiled, cryptic and showed a penetrating and surreal wit. Above all, he was clearly oppressed by the accelerating loss of the idyllic world of his youth.

As his beloved Malibu increasingly swarmed with interlopers, Dora's go-outs became more like slalom runs as he wove intricate paths through scores of kooks, pushing and shoving his way along the zippering hollows. When accused of being ruthless, Dora told Surfer, "It's a lie. I'm vicious. We're all pushing and shoving, jockeying for position, and if I get the wave first -- if I'm in the best position -- then I feel I deserve it."

From http://www.surfline.com/surfaz/dora_miki.cfm

In a gradual but very powerful way, seeing Miki Dora on that single ride changed all that.

Firstly, by opening my eyes to the exquisite beauty and grace of someone else’s surfing and the tremendous enjoyment that virtuosity could engender.

“One can see everything there is to see in Mickey Dora when he is surfing. He is quick, supremely conscious, and he is always the first to know when the waves are coming and where. His timing and balance defy description. He is upon occasion even playful out there. He will segué into an impromptu session of “Quasimodo’s” and “Coffins” and “spinners” or he will simply surf backwards. For the most part, however, there is no one who takes his surfing any more seriously than” he does.*

From http://www.surfwriter.net/mikis_tribute.htm

On the beach of Malibu in the mid-sixties I became aware of a dark shadowy figure wearing dark sunglasses at a time when nobody except movie stars and mobsters wore them. He was dressed in non beach attire of a black knee length trench coat looking like Paladin or some other gunslinger from an old western movie. He was older than the average salty gremmie of the day. The age advantage combined with his unique perspective allowed Miki Dora to manipulate and play with the surf scene like a cat playing with a mouse. This enigmatic wildcard did not hang around the beach and seemed to have a real life beyond the beach which seemed strange to the rest of us beach bums. He found the social structure of the beach claustrophobic and too confining for his self image. In time his absence and conscious separation from the surfing crowd bred his mysterious aura to those of us who surfed and languished all day at the beach.

From http://www.westwindsurf.org/pages/revie ... _dora.html

Above the crowd and outside the mainstream - this was the separate, arrogant reality upon which Mickey Dora built the legend of the Cat.

From http://atomicbride.com/dora.html

Of all the surfers of the Sixties, Micki Dora was, by far, the most notorious. Dora had started making a name for himself in the Southern California surfing scene of the "Pre-Gidget Era," in the mid-1950s. By 1957, he was already well-known throughout the surfing world. As champion surfer and fellow Malibu rider Mike Doyle reminds us: "the unrivaled king of Malibu in those days was Mickey Dora, 'Da Cat.'" The way Dora rode was widely emulated and his attitude toward the commercialization of the sport was eventually shared by many of us. Dora was extremely influential throughout the 1960s and 1970s. His "legend" continues on, despite his death in January 2002. And, although less so than in those days of yore, the Dora mystique continues to effect surf culture -- more so than we know or some would care to admit.

From http://www.legendarysurfers.com/surf/le ... _dora.html
willli
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Ripper (more than 100 posts)
Posts: 286
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 6:18 am
Location: long island, NY

Post by willli »

well :idea: I :shock: guess :roll: that :!: cleared :wink: dat :lol: up 8)

ALOHAALOHA

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
User avatar
Smokin Rock
Legend (Contribution King!)
Legend (Contribution King!)
Posts: 1068
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2003 12:20 am
Location: downtown Kapaau

Post by Smokin Rock »

gee..... thanks bryan. i always thought he was sigfried and roys silent partner.
you one fart smeller!
"This sucks more than anything that has ever sucked before." Butt-head
DrStrange
Legend (Contribution King!)
Legend (Contribution King!)
Posts: 629
Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2003 7:15 pm
Location: Sebastopol, CA

Post by DrStrange »

That bit in the article about how people accepting it is that last bug in the design process makes me laugh and pisses me off. People are so willfully stupid its hard to imagine how we've survived so long. People dismiss it out of hand without ever riding one and probably mostly without ever even seeing anyone else riding one. Reminds me of someone I know (footboarder) who recently found out I was getting a kneeboard. He went on a 5 minute tirade about how stupid and non-functional KB's are and why would anyone be stupid enough to ride one when they could stand up yada yada. When he paused for breath I asked the obvious; turns out he's never ridden one and maybe vaguely remembers seeing some one riding one once a long time ago somewhere, or maybe not.

This all ties in with a lot of other recent conversations about govt., environment, various social issues etc. ARRRGHHH!
User avatar
Jon Manss
Legend (Contribution King!)
Legend (Contribution King!)
Posts: 504
Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2003 5:00 pm
Location: Santa Cruz

Post by Jon Manss »

Dr. Strange hits it on the head. Why are the majority so set in their way until someone finally shows them something new? This talk of new design and inovative shapes have gone hand and hand with Kneeboarding. No wonder a new footboard is interesting to us. Keep the eye out for the new and let the majority run with their pack.
Ted
Grom (25 or less posts to site)
Grom (25 or less posts to site)
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:21 pm
Location: Bakerspatch

Post by Ted »

some of you are in dire need of a life!What the hell was all THAT!
Beeline2.0
Legend (Contribution King!)
Legend (Contribution King!)
Posts: 1873
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2003 9:02 pm

Post by Beeline2.0 »

..
Last edited by Beeline2.0 on Wed Feb 27, 2008 2:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Post Reply