Quality versus privacy re:World Titles and KSUSA Titles

[Steeno]

I will be blunt.....I wont come if we have to compete for waves with non competitors, Craig "splashy" Ashdown said it all above in Black and White. I would be so pissed to travel across the planet to be knocked out by an unfair situation like a non competitor.

To be knocked out by a competitor is fine with me, they surfed better....happens alot...it was fair. Off course I would love to surf a perfect point with no-one else out.....but if that is not the case...we all have to surf the same stuff anyway be it 1 foot or 6 foot, point break or beach break...with no non competitors

and its a shame to have a world title surf off in crud....I know who you mean chico

[Beeline2.0]

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[albert]

Hire some heavies that can use the money

While we are at it, how about we fork over the 50k for the trestles beach permit?

[splashy]

What comes first? The chicken or the egg? (Actually, it's the rooster... think about it)

If kneeboarding had the high profile and attracted the spectators and the cash that comes fom a free-market driven economy sponsored situation then we could just fork out the cash and go wherever we wanted....

...but if kneeboarding had the high profile and attracted the spectators and the cash that comes from a free-market driven economy sponsorship then would we all have started riding kneeboards? I think we are in the sport for much better reasons than this.

You want to run a world title for a fringe sport in great waves? Hire ALL the boats out of bali and have a floating comp on an island reef somewhere - DON'T hold it in a highly densely populated country which doesn't necessarily have mechanically repetitive swells and expect the fringe sport to attract the respect to clear the water (no offense to anyone). My piont is: get real. It is a CONTEST and part of being in a contest is being able to surf in ANY surf conditions.

This doesn't mean we go for the sloppiest, empiest waves around. Let's get the best waves we can reasonably expect with the legal right to be there and clear the water.

...as for hiring guys to go out in the water and keep it clear. That's fine by me. I probably won't be surfing West Coast US again, but I'm sure the local kneelos will cop some flack after all the circus has gone.....

Come on guys - this is all about having fun and getting the best performances in the best waves we can get. It's a no-brainer.

Maybe at the KSUSA World Titles there should be a discussion on how to fund $$$ to get better surf (legally) for the next event.

I'd pay an extra $20 a year on my membership to my national kneeboard association (if there was one to pay) to go towards a fund to pay for access to quality waves for the next event.

I reckon the guys in the kneeboard club would even pay an extra couple of $$$ for a bbq sausage at the end of each club gathering to pay for it - even though hardly any of them would go to the event anyway because they are not into comps, but love surfing together with their local kneelos.

Surely, as a community, kneeboarders can use what numbers we do have to try to collectively achieve some of the goals that we are all obviously wanting to achieve - a world title in quality waves being one of them.

.....so there you go..... I wonder where all that came from in my head????

[steve burpo]

Splashy's first post said it all.For a contest of this magnitude we definitely have to have a competitors only contest area.
I would much perfer Oceanside with the water cleared of non competitors and the authority to keep it that way,than a point break or any other break with the tought of having to hassle people to get waves.
I have surfed several contests at Steamers Lane before and was left with the choice of,do I cut this local off or lose my heat.Your damned if you do,damned if you don't.It doesn't make for a good contest atmosphere.

[Jon Manss]

Mr. Mutiny, On a bad day at HB people are bummed on a bad day at Ob SF, people drown. Sprocky, your point is well put and should be weighed with the highest regard. I have been watching the last few contest at Pleasure Point and yes there is a crew in the water at the same time. But what is missing is an ugly crowd. The contestants caught waves undisturbed and the general scene was respectable. Of course you can "what if" the scenerio until the cows come home, the bottom line is you will always have some sort snag at every contest. I am not a contest vet so my view is jaded by only two great experiences here. For those who have the experience I'd like to here from you as to where can you get a more positive vibe and surf set up than SC. I did not like the 10 day format rumored taking place here for the Worlds. I do like Tom's suggestion of the split of sites and most of the contest played out during the week. If you're seeking the least impact on the community this is it. My vote is here. Let's use next November as the final test for the up coming Worlds.

[SFKneelo]

Agree w/Spashy et al.

What we do for the World's, we should pilot this year to some extent. At least shoot for the same location. The 10-day format may not fly with the Mrs... but maybe a shorter version could. Another alignment to the World's would be to run age divisions instead of AA, AAA.

OB would be brutal. Or, it could be unreal. Or, it could be... unreliable.

What do you guys down SC way think about beachies South of you. Not as far South as... that place. More like Manresa. Hold the contest a bit earlier, like late Oct/early Nov. Although, given the choice between that and O'Side...

OK, following this stream of thought, winds in O'Side are great in Fall, and it's exposed to Souths and Norths. It has the contest precedence and meets the competitors-only requirements. O'Side in late Oct/early Nov gets my vote.

[ScottMac]

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[wino]

I was thinking Waddel as well. Good spot and out of the way for most people. Fall O-side is a good choice as well.
One of the things that made the '99 Worlds in New Zealand so fun was that it was a mobile contest. The organizers did their best to make sure we were on good contestable waves each day.
Would it be possible to have a mobile event utilizing the breaks in No. Santa Cruz County? There is a wide variety quality reefs, points and beaches in that area. Each morning we send scouts go out and check several locations and report conditions back to an event staging area. From the staging area we all go to the place that has the best waves and set up camp for the day.
Just a thought.

[Don]

... One of the things that made the '99 Worlds in New Zealand so fun was that it was a mobile contest. The organizers did their best to make sure we were on good contestable waves each day.
Would it be possible to have a mobile event utilizing the breaks in No. Santa Cruz County? There is a wide variety quality reefs, points and beaches in that area....

Wino, NZ was the best comp I've been to as far as keeping us in surfable conditions for such an extended amount of time. I'm afraid the US West Coast is too populated / regulated and frought w/ lawyers so we need permits (NZ needed permission from the Maori's which wasn't exactly easy either!).

Good input by all... we'll get this sorted out soon.

D

[Ler]

I still beleive the Worlds should be held in Australia. Some mysto reef. Send a U.S. team over. They have the support and have done done it before. I don't think there is a place in California, that can support such an event, its either crowds, locals, money, or all three. Do we really want a contest here? Before you answer that think about it? Could be ugly.

Ler

[DarcyM]

Ler, I think it's totally valid to have the World Contest in California, considering what the KSUSA has done to promote and support kneelos here in the states. California doesn't have a monopoly on ugly localism, it happens just about everywhere these days. And not everyone who wants to compete can afford to travel, hence the need to move the World contest around so everyone can take a shot at it before we're all dust.

I think the situation with the non-competitors out in the water at Pleasure Point also has to be weighed (as with all the factors) as to it's real affect on the competitors. Meaning, how much of a negative impact is it going to have on your ability to catch waves, ride waves, or perform to the best of your ability?

For the most part the non-competitors did stay out of the way on the shoulder, as Jon posted, and probably 95% of the competitors didn't have any problems. However, a few of us at the contest in 2004 had some unfortunate run-ins, even in the later heats. I personally had a pretty signicant encounter on one wave where I had to turn to avoid one paddler and weave between him and another longboarder on the shoulder. At the time I was pretty pissed off about it, but I made the wave and kept on going. Later I laughed about it. It really wasn't any more treacherous than any given day at my local spot, and I'm pretty sure I've done that same move before. Real world skills? I've gotten used to having to weave around the log jam, punch past and keep on going. Another bonus was being able to drop in on a footboarder with (at least imagined) impunity during a heat. I did give the guys sitting on the peak a bit of a tongue lashing during the heat because they were creeping into the contest zone a little too closely, and there was just a little local vibe going on. I think they backed off after the bitch was done.

But ... not everyone would feel that way, and not everyone would be comfortable dropping in on another rider, even if it was perfectly justified. I'm sure the seasoned guys would have no problem, but what about the Juniors, the (other) Ladies, and those with less contest experience?

I do think that the Santa Cruz locations are a tremendous arena to showcase what we can do, both in terms of visibilty and wave quality. That alone weighs heavily in its favor. Other things like logistics and support also have to be considered, but I think what Tom wanted here was to focus simply on the wave question, and what do the competitors want?

Conditional High Quality?
Or, Exclusive Access with potential?

Splashy makes some really good points. BUT, Jon is right - every contest has its snags.

Lets hear from some more of you ... that's why it's a forum.

[quadfin]

I agree with Sprocky. In the Worlds you would want the competitors to be unobstructed by dealing with contest site invaders. I considered the Pleasure Point KSUSA Tiltles to be more of a fun event but the longboarders that would drift into the contest area definitely affected my wave selection and wave count. It would not have been as fun if it was the World Titles.

A Water Patrol consisting of respected surfers like Peter Mel and friends would probably go a long way towards diffusing any long term local resentment in the Santa Cruz area.

And the split venue would spread the pain a little and minimize bad feelings/behavior from locals.

Maybe a stupid question but is The Ranch a possible venue...is it consistent enough? What about Blacks...surfed there in a kneeboard event in the 80's and other than the hike it was fun.

[kage]

Why look for bruisers when we've got Darcy? Just give her a bullhorn and we're good to go.

[Jack Beresford]

The World Titles are as much about what happens outside the water - most experienced competitors know that getting great waves in your heat is just a bonus. However, I think it's imperitive that we have water rights and the ability to police the lineup during the WTs. Whether you're coming 9 miles or 9,000 - nobody wants to end up behind a longboarder during your heat!

Regardless of the venue, I'm sure we can put on a first class event that attracts some of the best kneeboarders from around the world. California gets as good as anywhere - those interested in competing for a world title should be willing to make the trip.