For me Kneeboarding has been and will always be "underground", for the last twenty years I have lived at an isolated part of Australia's coast which is also close to one of Oz's quality waves. In my surfing history I could count on one hand the amount of times I have surfed with another kneelo or seen one surfing this district. For me this forum and the feedback and more importantly the photos have been a revelation. I don't mind being the "only" kneelo, infact I don't care at all, but at the same time I would also love to be able to watch other guys surf. I don't think there will ever be a huge increase in numbers, I thought during the great boogie boarding days there would be but many switched to stand up as they got older or stopped altogether. My only concern is that our numbers will drop to the point where Bruce and other shapers don't have the numbers to keep shaping and we can't get our boards built properly by the blokes with a passion for the sport, however, I think that is a long way off if it will happen at all, so we need to keep paddling out pulling in and attacking our sport with as much fervour as possible!!
Looking at the amount of photos and reading posts on planned trips perhaps Indo is the next kneeboarding boom area, surely with the amount of guys visiting some of the local groms may take it up.
Where is kneeboarding going?
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halbs
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wheres kneeboarding headed?
getting there is often as good as getting there
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Doc Turbo
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Re: wheres kneeboarding headed?
Took the words right out of my mouth. There are so many many little groms hanging around my car at the beach. I asked, why they aren't surfing, answer, NO BOARD, or my brother using the board. So maybe I can dig up some old kneeboard, and see how it develops. Who knows.halbs wrote:For me Kneeboarding has been and will always be "underground", for the last twenty years I have lived at an isolated part of Australia's coast which is also close to one of Oz's quality waves. In my surfing history I could count on one hand the amount of times I have surfed with another kneelo or seen one surfing this district. For me this forum and the feedback and more importantly the photos have been a revelation. I don't mind being the "only" kneelo, infact I don't care at all, but at the same time I would also love to be able to watch other guys surf. I don't think there will ever be a huge increase in numbers, I thought during the great boogie boarding days there would be but many switched to stand up as they got older or stopped altogether. My only concern is that our numbers will drop to the point where Bruce and other shapers don't have the numbers to keep shaping and we can't get our boards built properly by the blokes with a passion for the sport, however, I think that is a long way off if it will happen at all, so we need to keep paddling out pulling in and attacking our sport with as much fervour as possible!!
Looking at the amount of photos and reading posts on planned trips perhaps Indo is the next kneeboarding boom area, surely with the amount of guys visiting some of the local groms may take it up.
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RMcKnee
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I have to say I agree with Halbs and Doc Turbo. I like "underground", always have, always will. And I know saying so risks charges of nostalgia, but I look fondly back at the past, when we didn't all have to fit in neat little compartments quite so much.
I guess my beef with the business side of surfing is that over the past 30 odd years, the big companies have attracted a lot of people to"surf culture" and made a lot of money along the way, while the main outcome for most people who have been part of surfing throughout the same period has been ... overcrowding in many areas. The difficult thing about this from what some might call the "purist" perspective, is that the commercialization of surfing has also brought many huge benefits.
And after all, let's face it, all surfers are the same in some regards. Whether they ride standing up, sitting down, on an esky lid or a baking tray, they all need the same stuff; boardshorts, rashies, wetsuits etc. and someone's gonna supply the stuff.
Nov said
So there's some people out there having fun and spreading the love, and then there are people like Steeno and Farrer, spreading stoke in a different way by producing photos and video, and then there are those who love the competition side of things. Some of us can, and do, operate as "stokers" in more than one way. But that's the kneelo community helping itself, and what I keep harping back to about the 60's and 70's, what we might call the pre-commercial era, (though how accurate that is is moot), is that back then, the kneelo was just another part of the big surfing community. Then, every surf shop sold surfboards, at most of 'em you could get to talk to the guy who'd shape your board, and pretty often there'd be a kneeboard of some sort on the rack. it may not have been a good one every time, but it was there. Well, those days are long gone. Now, because it's easier for Big Business to pull Slater, or AI or Fanning out when they wanna promote their company brand, kneeboarding always gets treated by BB as the idiot bastard son. Some support is given, but not the kind that sees posters or video of the current kneelo world champ in the surf emporium. Now that's something to aim for. Imagine walking into the Ripcurl flagship store to find that old 80's footage of Novakov at Aussie Pipe playing on repeat. Wouldn't that have an impact on any grommet? And don't get me wrong, I have no axe to grind with any of the three names I mentioned earlier; they're all thoroughly decent people who deserve everything they've achieved and good on 'em for achieving it. But I guess it is a little odd that there are no kneelo equivalents to those guys, (especially as Farrer is such a good looking fella, I bet he could sell a stack of clothes)...I just don't think about it that much cause ... well, as Halb said
For me Kneeboarding has been and will always be "underground"
It's an unjust world, and that's why recognition for kneelos is limited to a couple of lines in an Andrew Kidman interview. Slater's influence on a generation is undoubted, but isn't he the guy whose backhand tube stance used to be so low he was to all intents dropkneeing? The same guy who said "kneeboarding is the dodo of surfing." The same guy who's now winning contests on what looks like something developed from a kneeboard design? In spite of this lack of recognition, the kneelo is still there, just the same as he ever was. Kids just need to look, that's all.
Then there's the surfing press, where we've all read stuff like "if your board has more than three fins you have the wrong equipment" the same press that tells the kids guff like that if they carry their board fins first they're holding it wrong. I mean, really, wouldn't any one of us rather the surf press spent a little more effort educating its readers about things like who pulled off the first carving 360, who pulled off the first barrel roll, who was the first surfer to maneuver in the tube.
No matter how you look at it, being a kneelo sometimes feels like being part of an unfairly ignored minority, a pretty influential minority, but ultimately an unrecognised one. It just ain't fair! In fact, it sucks, which is probably why lots of kneelos are happy to be "underground". If the rest of the world don't get it, F.U.C.M.
Nov said
I find it difficult at times not to be cynical, but I'm working on it! It just may be that at the moment Narrabeen is a little more open-mided than the Goldie. It wouldn't surprise me. Some days you really need to be a Class 1 A-hole to get a wave at the Superbank. 
Ask the Coach!
As for giving anyone a go on my board...anywhere between Kirra and the Tweed river conversations with strangers tend to be limited to snarling, growling, cursing etc.
No, I'm exaggerating, seriously, it seems you guys down there at NN are a pretty social crew, which is great. 
Maybe every kneelo should make a vow to give away a board to an interested other, preferably a grommet, at least once in their surfing life.
I guess my beef with the business side of surfing is that over the past 30 odd years, the big companies have attracted a lot of people to"surf culture" and made a lot of money along the way, while the main outcome for most people who have been part of surfing throughout the same period has been ... overcrowding in many areas. The difficult thing about this from what some might call the "purist" perspective, is that the commercialization of surfing has also brought many huge benefits.
And after all, let's face it, all surfers are the same in some regards. Whether they ride standing up, sitting down, on an esky lid or a baking tray, they all need the same stuff; boardshorts, rashies, wetsuits etc. and someone's gonna supply the stuff.
Nov said
I know, my suggestion seems lame, but if my getting out there inspires someone, anyone, that's better than nothing. Getting young surfers used to seeing kneelos around has to help, I reckon. I'm not world title material, but I can actually ride a wave from beginning to end on a good day, and I get a kick out of seeing grommets getting a kick out of something impressive I've done while riding said wave on my knees. Positive feedback, see?Has 'getting out there and surfing our best' done anything for kneeboarding in the last 20 or so years? Hardly. We've only seen kneeboarding dwindle and die off.
So there's some people out there having fun and spreading the love, and then there are people like Steeno and Farrer, spreading stoke in a different way by producing photos and video, and then there are those who love the competition side of things. Some of us can, and do, operate as "stokers" in more than one way. But that's the kneelo community helping itself, and what I keep harping back to about the 60's and 70's, what we might call the pre-commercial era, (though how accurate that is is moot), is that back then, the kneelo was just another part of the big surfing community. Then, every surf shop sold surfboards, at most of 'em you could get to talk to the guy who'd shape your board, and pretty often there'd be a kneeboard of some sort on the rack. it may not have been a good one every time, but it was there. Well, those days are long gone. Now, because it's easier for Big Business to pull Slater, or AI or Fanning out when they wanna promote their company brand, kneeboarding always gets treated by BB as the idiot bastard son. Some support is given, but not the kind that sees posters or video of the current kneelo world champ in the surf emporium. Now that's something to aim for. Imagine walking into the Ripcurl flagship store to find that old 80's footage of Novakov at Aussie Pipe playing on repeat. Wouldn't that have an impact on any grommet? And don't get me wrong, I have no axe to grind with any of the three names I mentioned earlier; they're all thoroughly decent people who deserve everything they've achieved and good on 'em for achieving it. But I guess it is a little odd that there are no kneelo equivalents to those guys, (especially as Farrer is such a good looking fella, I bet he could sell a stack of clothes)...I just don't think about it that much cause ... well, as Halb said
For me Kneeboarding has been and will always be "underground"
It's an unjust world, and that's why recognition for kneelos is limited to a couple of lines in an Andrew Kidman interview. Slater's influence on a generation is undoubted, but isn't he the guy whose backhand tube stance used to be so low he was to all intents dropkneeing? The same guy who said "kneeboarding is the dodo of surfing." The same guy who's now winning contests on what looks like something developed from a kneeboard design? In spite of this lack of recognition, the kneelo is still there, just the same as he ever was. Kids just need to look, that's all.
Then there's the surfing press, where we've all read stuff like "if your board has more than three fins you have the wrong equipment" the same press that tells the kids guff like that if they carry their board fins first they're holding it wrong. I mean, really, wouldn't any one of us rather the surf press spent a little more effort educating its readers about things like who pulled off the first carving 360, who pulled off the first barrel roll, who was the first surfer to maneuver in the tube.
No matter how you look at it, being a kneelo sometimes feels like being part of an unfairly ignored minority, a pretty influential minority, but ultimately an unrecognised one. It just ain't fair! In fact, it sucks, which is probably why lots of kneelos are happy to be "underground". If the rest of the world don't get it, F.U.C.M.
Nov said
No, not most, but ...What I really really want to see is a generation of surfers who are open-minded, capable of making informed decisions about styles of surfing all by themselves and who welcome diversity in the water. I have the misfortune to live and surf in a very crowded (surfing) part of Oz. I've recently moved away from one of the best pointbreaks we have because of overcrowding and narrow-minded attitudes in the water.You seem to be implying that most kids that take up standup surfing are incredibly shallow and only really do it for their image.
I find it difficult at times not to be cynical, but I'm working on it! It just may be that at the moment Narrabeen is a little more open-mided than the Goldie. It wouldn't surprise me. Some days you really need to be a Class 1 A-hole to get a wave at the Superbank. Ask the Coach!As for giving anyone a go on my board...anywhere between Kirra and the Tweed river conversations with strangers tend to be limited to snarling, growling, cursing etc.
No, I'm exaggerating, seriously, it seems you guys down there at NN are a pretty social crew, which is great. Maybe every kneelo should make a vow to give away a board to an interested other, preferably a grommet, at least once in their surfing life.
Gee
I had a surf on a nice freezing cold deserted beach yesterday.
I was about two k down from the closest carpark. One guy wandered down the beach after I'd been in the water for an hour and played in the shorey while I sat out the back on that nice deep water sand bank.
The waves weren't bad, but the crowd was good.
I reckon that's where kneeboarding is going.
Where it's always gone.
I had a surf on a nice freezing cold deserted beach yesterday.
I was about two k down from the closest carpark. One guy wandered down the beach after I'd been in the water for an hour and played in the shorey while I sat out the back on that nice deep water sand bank.
The waves weren't bad, but the crowd was good.
I reckon that's where kneeboarding is going.
Where it's always gone.
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Doc Turbo
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Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;
Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,
And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.
I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I--
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference
---Robert Frost---
the kneeboarders path is the one less traveled by for sure, and there are those who will go down this path in every generation
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;
Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,
And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.
I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I--
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference
---Robert Frost---
the kneeboarders path is the one less traveled by for sure, and there are those who will go down this path in every generation
Last edited by Doc Turbo on Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Nov
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If that strategy worked, there should be a ton of kneelo grommets emerging from the NSW south coast- there isn't.RMcKnee wrote:I know, my suggestion seems lame, but if my getting out there inspires someone, anyone, that's better than nothing. Getting young surfers used to seeing kneelos around has to help, I reckon. I'm not world title material, but I can actually ride a wave from beginning to end on a good day, and I get a kick out of seeing grommets getting a kick out of something impressive I've done while riding said wave on my knees. Positive feedback, see?
There's a difference between being underground and being dead.So there's some people out there having fun and spreading the love, and then there are people like Steeno and Farrer, spreading stoke in a different way by producing photos and video, and then there are those who love the competition side of things. Some of us can, and do, operate as "stokers" in more than one way. But that's the kneelo community helping itself, and what I keep harping back to about the 60's and 70's, what we might call the pre-commercial era, (though how accurate that is is moot), is that back then, the kneelo was just another part of the big surfing community. Then, every surf shop sold surfboards, at most of 'em you could get to talk to the guy who'd shape your board, and pretty often there'd be a kneeboard of some sort on the rack. it may not have been a good one every time, but it was there. Well, those days are long gone. Now, because it's easier for Big Business to pull Slater, or AI or Fanning out when they wanna promote their company brand, kneeboarding always gets treated by BB as the idiot bastard son. Some support is given, but not the kind that sees posters or video of the current kneelo world champ in the surf emporium. Now that's something to aim for. Imagine walking into the Ripcurl flagship store to find that old 80's footage of Novakov at Aussie Pipe playing on repeat. Wouldn't that have an impact on any grommet? And don't get me wrong, I have no axe to grind with any of the three names I mentioned earlier; they're all thoroughly decent people who deserve everything they've achieved and good on 'em for achieving it. But I guess it is a little odd that there are no kneelo equivalents to those guys, (especially as Farrer is such a good looking fella, I bet he could sell a stack of clothes)...I just don't think about it that much cause ... well, as Halb said
For me Kneeboarding has been and will always be "underground"
Kneeboarding isn't underground- it's on life support. An example of a underground surf sport would be drop knee bodyboarding, it gets no mainstream exposure, it's shadowed by standup surfing and prone bodyboarding- yet there's a small but steady stream of grommets taking it up. It's an underground sport, kneeboarding is simply dying.
2101
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RMcKnee
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Reports of kneeboading's demise are greatly exaggerated.
Doc Turbo, great post.
Nov; kneeboarding on life support... maybe that's the best place for it. At least it's getting looked after. I still reckon it's "healthier" now than when I was a kid. Tell you one thing, the boards are heaps better.
Besides...
As sure as fire will burn
there's one thing you will learn
Is things you have cherished
are things that you have earned
Luck is when opportunity
meets with preparation
And the same is true for ev'ry generation
(Teddy Edwards, 1991)
Scott Mac said
Doc Turbo, great post.
Nov; kneeboarding on life support... maybe that's the best place for it. At least it's getting looked after. I still reckon it's "healthier" now than when I was a kid. Tell you one thing, the boards are heaps better.
Besides...
As sure as fire will burn
there's one thing you will learn
Is things you have cherished
are things that you have earned
Luck is when opportunity
meets with preparation
And the same is true for ev'ry generation
(Teddy Edwards, 1991)
Scott Mac said
Gumby saidKneeboarding is one of the few things that's actually not something for
everybody. There will always be those few who choose to walk the
path.
Headwax saidKneeboarding will change but it will allways be around. There will be someone that will need to be different.
I think I detect a theme emerging...I had a surf on a nice freezing cold deserted beach yesterday.
I was about two k down from the closest carpark.
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Nov
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How so? Are the vast majority (around 80%) of kneeboarders today in their 40s-50s or not?RMcKnee wrote:Reports of kneeboading's demise are greatly exaggerated.
Where is kneeboarding going to be once all those guys are dead?
When I said 'it's on life support', I meant it's hanging on by a thread. We have to do something or it will die.Nov; kneeboarding on life support... maybe that's the best place for it. At least it's getting looked after. I still reckon it's "healthier" now than when I was a kid. Tell you one thing, the boards are heaps better.
Besides...
Just saying 'she'll be right' won't make it true.I think I detect a theme emerging...
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Smokin Rock
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surfhorn
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Nice post, Doc Turbo. I haven't read that Frost poem fully since the mid 1960's!
KBing isn't for everybody but, fortunately for us, the boards keep getting better.
One thing I do is let kids use my board to standup surf. I then tell them to ride a wave on their knees and tuck into a little barrel. They paddle back out pretty stoked. You never know what path will be chosen.
KBing isn't for everybody but, fortunately for us, the boards keep getting better.
One thing I do is let kids use my board to standup surf. I then tell them to ride a wave on their knees and tuck into a little barrel. They paddle back out pretty stoked. You never know what path will be chosen.
kbing since plywood days
Nov,
First off - my compliments on your writing and clarity of thought. A huge change from the Nov of 2003 when you signed up.
Great to see your energy. Forget the old duffers. We've suffered years of attrition and become resigned and cynical. When I had your energy and passion I was instrumental in the starting of the first Suth African kneeboard club which led directly to the first SA pro contest, the 2nd and 3rd clubs, the first worlds and the great kneeboard revival of 1812 etc etc. Now I'm another mildly depressed old fart in search of inspiration.
Go for it!
As Paul Kelly sings "From little things big things grow"*
How about devising a kneelo/standup contest format?
I'd be happy to support it at the Coopers Cup at the Island in November (but last year most observers ended up legless)
*http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3f2x12ShPg
First off - my compliments on your writing and clarity of thought. A huge change from the Nov of 2003 when you signed up.
Great to see your energy. Forget the old duffers. We've suffered years of attrition and become resigned and cynical. When I had your energy and passion I was instrumental in the starting of the first Suth African kneeboard club which led directly to the first SA pro contest, the 2nd and 3rd clubs, the first worlds and the great kneeboard revival of 1812 etc etc. Now I'm another mildly depressed old fart in search of inspiration.
Go for it!
As Paul Kelly sings "From little things big things grow"*
How about devising a kneelo/standup contest format?
I'd be happy to support it at the Coopers Cup at the Island in November (but last year most observers ended up legless)
*http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3f2x12ShPg
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dua anjing
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No lengthy post today; gotta go book my plot in the cemetery!