Attempting going flipperless...suggestions?

[mal]

well real big waves is a different storey. you have to be comfortable or your not having fun and thats what its all about. but once you are used to fin free surfing theres no looking back , of course this may take a year or two

[Jacksquid]

There's a lot of truth and experience in all those comments - grateful for all that.

After reading and thinking, a thought comes to mind: If you've ever had bacon and eggs, the chicken was involved but the pig was committed. So, I'm gonna be the pig and commit - suck it up and pay my dues without the flippers (unless the surf is especially juicy that day and the learning curve doesn't warrant it). I really respect all your comments on both sides of the fence and I can definitely see it both ways. But as a friend once said to me, "It's always good to be a beginner at something." I'll be newbie at going finless, but I suspect it will pay off for me in the long run. I've also been noticing a lot of stand-ups catching waves finless on boards way smaller than mine, and I view that as a personal challenge which motivates me to no end.

I also know that this whole surfing gig is a journey with unexpected twists and turns, and what may be truth today, may be an old fiction tomorrow. But I'll definitely give it a go finless for now in small to medium surf.

Cheers,

Jacksquid

[KAVA]

oh we are supposed to use the fins/flippers for knee boarding? I started using them to get to the bottom quicker when a cleanup set comes in Hmmm im gonna have to try using them to catch waves with now.

[MIK911]

On a similar note, i've heard reference to "4 wheel driving". I tried paddling and kicking, but am unable to accomplish this--if i'm in position to paddle (far up on board), then my legs are too far forward to kick, and if i'm kicking, then the board is way in front of me, with arm outstretched.

So how are some able to paddle and kick?--super short boards?
For fin kicking, is it usual to have arm outstretched - like using a paddle board in pool practice?

thanks

[hart]

OK..time to fess up

I have NEVER worn flippers. I was riding five-sixes at 14 years old and I was over six feet tall c 1972

If I wanted to ride five-six kneeboards, that was my deal..no-one elses

So, I learnt to paddle (just like EVERYONE else in the water) and remember..no lids back then

Simon Farrer once wrote..

"How are we, as kneeboarders. meant to expect respect in the line-up when we use an advantage that everyone else doesn't ever consider?"

i thought it hard to argue that logic ..particularly given that it arrived almost 15 years after I did

BUT..

Following Santa Cruz (read two weeks ago) I made a personal promise to surf everyday once I got home

I even said that now I am turning 50 if it means I have to START wearing flippers then so it will be..at least I wont be surfing a mal..

SO I GOT THE PAIR OF $180 FINS I BOUGHT 5 YEARS AGO OUT..and put them on my feet last Sunday for the 3rd surf in 3 days..thinking, its got to help me get more waves (yeah, right )

And that was the last time I have surfed now for 10 bloody days

I haven't even SNEEZED since then let alone shaped

I got stuck in a 4 foot noreast shorey without being able to duck-dive from a standing-start (from the beach) and tore the ribcartiledge down the right-side of my body

I wasn't able to take the wave head-on like I would normally in what was only thigh-deep water..the flippers acted like deepsea anchors when I needed it the LEAST and stopped me twisting into the energy

OUCH

i have now given the things away so I won't ever be tempted again

never, and I mean never..again

hart

If I can paddle into it..it will be on a kneeboard

[strudle]

On take off I "4 wheel drive it" kicking from knee. I paddle hands only when paddling out. Occasionally slip back to use feet only when putting around the lineup. But I've found that duck diving is where I value my fins most. I'm a flea weight with a 24" wide boat, I mean board, and kicking when duck diving really helps get me under. I've tried going no fins a number of times, and found no problems except I couldn't paddle out on a bigger day without them.

[scoop]

to all respondents

NOT being in the top echelon of experienced kneeboarders I still feel the urge to comment
It could only be what one is use to ...
If you learn to drive on the right side ... it comes natural ... I can't really define why I used fins but most likely cause all my other kneelo friends that introduced me to that direction in surfing wore fins in the early 70's
I too have tried the no fin approach but to me it felt like trying to propel in air ... (as MIK911 said ) ... 4 wheel driving ... to me it was like I was in the mud with slicks on ... so have always used them ... even as age takes control and I don't keep as fit as past years but still get out there and do what I love
It has to be an individual thing ... same as stand-up compared to kneeling ... do what YOU want to feel comfortable ... just get out there and have fun

cheers

Tony

[KAVA]

best for walking on the reef or fending off a hungry landlord? booties or flippers/swim fins?

[john -]

i have now given the things away so I won't ever be tempted again

never, and I mean never..again

hart

cos you should never say never bruce, as age catches up, I offer free lessons in flipper technology...you just have think like flipper, dancing on top of the water...or think christian...remember how Jesus walked on water...it wasnt that his knees were made for kneeboarding it was that he wore flippers...cos he was humble

tayatah om bekandze bekandze maha bekandze bekandze randza sumangate soha

a mantra for your ribs and ribbing

[john -]

now that ive read all the post

one of my favourite things to see his Finger (Gary) crusing out to the line up, arms folded across his island freak just kicking...no bother no hassle no concern, very nostalgic


no flipper surfing is defintely cool and dynamic and best for thruster type vertical surfers and probably the odd quad fin rider too


but you cant just lazily cruise out to the line up...image is everything

but its in the eye of the beholder

if the internet and the vids hit town when i was 18 maybe...




has anyone mentioned to Farrer that King Neptune/Poseidon sported fins along with the trident



Jason and the Argonats remains a favourite film from my chidhood

[Craig]

I've found as my boards have gotten longer over the years 80% of my paddeling is w/ my arms. I make it a point to arm paddel as much as posible.
There is also advantages for the 20% fin power however.
Examples; a strong south swell is running @ my local along w/ that wicked sideshore current.
I'm able to stay on point for those nice lefthanders while the stand up crew are a quarter mile down the beach gassed
@ 52 fins extend my sessions.
As for my annul visits to the Northshore, Duckfeet are a must for me, they can save your arse.
I find Respect in the line up has nothing to do w/ whats on my feet or not.
I'm w/ Tony do what works the best for you and have fun.

sTilL a gRoM

[Markem]

Ok so I've been using fins for 30+ years but was curios after going to OZ for the '02 World's why they weren't using fins. I was given the same comment Bruce borrowed from Simon about respect of other surfers. I have total respect for both of those men but the thought process to me is not logical. If I cared about thier respect then wouldn't I stand up. I love kneeriding and I believe I've gained respect for what I do on a waves not how I get into them. My son is a standie and he gave me grief about my fins so I went without them for a few months, not only did I not get respect, but the better locals noticed I was missing some of the sets that I normally kick over too especially when there's a southerly drift and they are all out of position, I usually get the best of them just luck I guess.
I'm not ready to give up the large muscle group of the leg to better myself in some standies opinion. I remember when the leash came out and you were a wimp to use it. Would the surfers respect us more if we didn't use leashes. Who cares what they think, if I get more waves with my fins than w/o to me it's a simple decision, plus my legs last longer than my arms every time.
All that being said it does feel good to ride finless, but if there's a strong current, a long paddle, or multiple set waves to me it seems very locgical to use the legs when needed.
One final thing I've noticed is my Blast boards are more comfortable kicking than my Flashie which is more comfortable arm paddeling, could it be since Bud wears fins, and Bruce doesn't that the boards are meant to plane differently. This is just my opinion of the few boards I have, not worth a hill of flippers to anyone else I'm sure.

Do what you love, how YOU like to do it !
M2

[El Nino]

mmmmm.... bacon...

[skansand]

so how about gettting into an early plane before everyone else....sometimes im sitting 20 feet or more outside of everyone and getting up on unbroken swells!!!..
..im doing my bottom turn/carving before anyone else in the lineup has a chance to swing their board around.....it fcking great....takes all the frustration out of surfing...
.im competing with longboards for the set of the day....and i usually get it.... .....im sure the rest of the lineup doesnt respect me for it ,but they dont argue with it....if they COULD use flippers im sure they WOULD.....i take it to new levels with webbed gloves and a kneeboard over 6'0 and my trusty churchills ive had for probably 7 years....if ducks would fit me,the longboarders wouldnt even be competition....

[DarcyM]

I wear flippers all the time (even at work! -- NOT! ---) because it feels natural to me and without them on in the water I feel naked. But I've been wearing flippers in the water since I was 9 years old. It's what I know. "4 wheel drive" is also natural for me, it's how I motor when I need to get moving fast and I've been doing it so long I don't even have to think about it.

Bruce - so sorry to hear you got slammed! Yes, blame the flippers, but also realize that if you'd been used to wearing flippers, you probably would have approached the situation in a different manner. It's just not what you're used to, and your body didn't respond in a way that it was accostomed to. Hope you heal fast and damn it sucks getting old but don't let it deter you!

Same with those wanting to go without. If it's not what you're used to, it will take time to adjust. And there's a possibilty that you will get into a situation where you're going to take a beating (See Hart above). But if it's what you want to do, go for it. Don't expect that going without flippers will be an automatic ticket to respect, though. Some people will still think you're a weirdo.

I do envy the guys that can run out into the lineup sans flippers or do the rock dance on the shore while I'm flapping and quacking. But I also love cruising out to the line-up in full kick mode, or stealth positioning in the pack, or holding in place in a strong current while all others are swept down stream. And turn and go late drops under full power are my bread and butter.

I overheard Gigs say something to the effect of "If you can use flippers why go without?" They certainly don't seem to affect his ability to super rotate the board or push the tail of his board with his feet.

With or without, it doesn't matter to me what other people do or use or wear out in the water. I'm stoked that they're riding waves and having fun.