20 interesting statemente re quad v tri

[MTBarrels]

...<snipped>...MTB,

love your flex-spoons; do you still ride 'em?
Big single fins appear the way to go for spoons, due to the flex characteristics you want to encourage in the outer corners of the tail...
but what's your take on singles for use in more 'conventional' craft?
I ask, as I want to experiment with a narrower plan shape, say 20-21"x5'6", say (and thicker than the norm, maybe more of a 'hull').
I guess I'm thinking retro too, heh..just want to try something different.
any comments welcome

Do I still ride 'em? Yes. However, when I went to wider tails back in the early 70's, I changed to twin fins--and have been using them on all the spoons/semi-spoons that I've built and ridden since then (with only one or two brief exceptions--and those were still a long time ago).

So as far as your question about single fins, I don't feel qualified to give an informed opinion about the merits/demerits of single fins on narrower planforms. However, I know of a kneeboarder in the San Diego County area who surfs a retro style kneeboard with a single fin and swears by it.

(An aside in regard to your flex/interference comment: My twin fins are mounted 1-3/4" inboard of the perimeter of the planform and within the area of rail flex. Hence only the forward half of the fin is glassed to the board in order to minimize interference with the rail flex.)

[MTBarrels]

...<snipped>...Today on a hunch I slid the front fins all the way back. Kept G3000 in the back. ... and wadda I find?

The board is looser with the front fin FURTHER back. And I got the drive I wanted. Must be related to unifying the fulcrum point...<snipped>...

Correct...e.g. it's easier to rotate a narrow, deep blade/fin/paddle about it's (vertical) axis ("fulcrum point") than it is a wider, shorter one of equal area.

mtb

[surfhorn]

I spent my early KB years with a nice 12' flex fin with and w/out little side tri's. When I went to a wider template, even with the little tri's, it wouldn't hold the edge that well. Most of my singles weren't over 19 1/2"....if that. Those boards went well in big 'ol grinding waves....it was all about speed and long lines. Forget about flat, mushy faces though. Stay tight in the pocket and look for backdoor situations.

I switched to a fish when I moved to Socal in 1979 but then the thruster set up emerged and I was able to experiment with that design, which more closely resembled the type of surfing I liked. And it allowed me to surf a wider board and opened up a wider array of waves to me.

But a big twangy flex fin is such a kick on a screaming fast wave.

[HALFMANRIPS/MIKE GARRETT]

AFTER RIDING MY POTATOCHIP SQUASH TAILED QUAD FOR THE LAST
18 YRS. IT'S NICE TO SEE EVERYONE IS FINALLY CATCHING ON ? OR SHOULD I SAY UP

JUST RIP IT

[john -]

hey wax

it would be of interest to hear from Techno as his last parkes quad had four boxes and im wondering if he tinkered with them

also how does the effect of a back rider like yourself differ say from a more foward rider like me or techno (?) in terms of moving fins back for loosness and drive

would a foward rider achieve the same results as you?

[Brendan]

I went from a parkes tri (with his big template fins) to a parkes quad of the same dimensions last September and I'll echo Headwax's words....Gumbo wipeouts...paddle on, turn too much, bury nose into face of wave after turning TOO much and proceed to surf backwards until I fall off with GeeTee laughing his head off at me!

Trying to generate drive off a fin that is not there. Took some learning and I started to get it by staying low and forward, trying to be as light as I can on the board and going from rail to rail. Also changed the front fins to larger Occys which made it a little more drivier. Damn thing turns on a dime and is way faster down the line than the Tri!

Suffered a fin chop to the quad in January (drop-in holidaymaker on a 80 year old single fin) and went back to the Tri. Took some time to get the thing moving. No fast bottom turns like I use to and mis-timed cutbacks. Tried to hitch a ride on the back of a surf ski on Sunday (my fault in trying to get around behind him) and pulled a FCS plug out, so after fixing the Quad I'm back on it this weekend. Will be interesting!

To me very different boards to surf with my limited experience but fun to explore.

Brendan

[john -]

hi dorje,,

life is good hey?

As a guess I'd say your style is more refined because you are using body torque.
I'm just a "grunt" surfer who likes the whack off the bottom, that crisp cutting sound as the fins crank the turn. Turning off the fins is like kicking a soccer ball full of air versus kicking one full of cotton wool.

....

it is it is!!!

I always wanted to be a grunt surfer but i realised 20 years ago it was not going to happen

surfing some great waves at nelson's beach just north of Tarthra (near Bega) in NSW some friends commented on my developing skill in cut backs

i mentioned the word "radical" they laughed

"ah,... no mate actually there smooth very smooth" - its perhaps why i took to a parkes quad from a tri without a hitch

anyways....a great analysis wax and Bredan....i think i will put some bigger fins in the back during the comming surf season (which actually started last weekend and this long weekend looks good too) to sample - perhaps a 4 plus day - ive got plugs so thats about the most i can do

[Brendan]

What a difference a week makes.

Surfed at the same break as last week but this time on the quad. Conditions were only marginally cleaner.

Found out what I've been missing for 3 months. The quad works so much better in the pocket. Fell off a couple of times trying to carve a bottom turn and tail slid badly on a face as backwash hit me but what a hoot! Conditions were perfect yesterday but only 2-3 foot (4-5ft face). Son Jake (12yo) and I surfed for nearly 4 hours. Me on a quad and him on one of Albert's old thrusters.

So here is my view on best surf for each board over the other.
Quad: Cleaner more top to bottom waves.
Thruster: Fuller, larger less clean waves.

This could be a result of rail design as the thruster has softer rails but similar rocker?

Why does the quad turn so sharply when you surf rail to rail? The thruster surely doesn't turn as agressively.

Brendan

[lowrider]

Brendan,

Same thing here, mate.
I've been re-discovering my quad after a couple of years layoff, riding tri's.
There's been a great run of swell here, culminating in 2.0m point waves at Granite Bay last week. It just seems to drive and project so well...
and from a board that's about 8 years old; can't wait to get my hands on a new Parkes, something like that referred to on the 'fish?' thread by 'analbirth'

cheers

andy

[Brendan]

Andy,
I couldn't believe the difference
1 week
Same Break
Similar size and shape of wave

The Thruster would not turn anywhere like the quad would.

Go the Parkes.
My quad is a 6ft, 23 1/2, swallow tail, double concave to V, fairly hard rails up to front of rear pads and are turned under (board wider than sharp edge of rail except for last 6 inches of rail).

Brendan

[john -]

i think the Parkes quad turns like it does due to toe in on the fins foward set up and the drive comes form (on my board at least) from being in a foward position

i have a rounded and thinned out square tail which both harnesses whatever energy there is in the wave (summer) but holds due to thinness in meater stuff (winter)

the fish shape does sound interesting though ....one day

its predicted to be 5 to 8 ft here this weekend so im looking to get some bigger fins to put in the back...i have one window this weekend so with luck the tide and wind will be good sat early am

please Huey!!!!