Lis style fish kneeboard

[Bryan Jackson]

Actually I believe the quote goes, "old age and TREACHERY... "

An observation: the standup surfing world (?) only seems to consider a Fish to be a Fish if it has keel fins (I can document this), whereas in the KB world it seems not to matter as much (quads and keels both qualify). Why is this (not that it really matters)?

I'm planning to build a balsa fish. I think that, whenever possible, KBer's should shape a board or two of their own...

[Flexman]

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[K-man]

Up here the tendency is to call anything flat.fat and wide regardless of no. of fins a fish.Since most of the kids don't know who lis was,they don't have a sense of the fish history.To me it's important to give credit where it belongs,to the innovator.Now of course that design has changed-modern rocker and fin design puts that design into another dimension.
I kindly remind the little buggers-It's not a fish sonny,it's a fish style

Of course this stuff matters.being a bunch of chatty surfers what would we do if not yammer away for days on something we all love

chuck.

[K-man]

Up here the tendency is to call anything flat.fat and wide regardless of no. of fins a fish.Since most of the kids don't know who lis was,they don't have a sense of the fish history.To me it's important to give credit where it belongs,to the innovator.Now of course that design has changed-modern rocker and fin design puts that design into another dimension.
I kindly remind the little buggers-It's not a fish sonny,it's a fish style

Of course this stuff matters.being a bunch of chatty surfers what would we do if not yammer away for days on something we all love

chuck.

[Bud]

Marky V,
Do build your Lis type board.

Steve Lis isn't a big guy so a scaled up version is a good idea for you.

For you I'd suggest a 17" nose X 22" wide point 2" up from center X 17" tail with a 12" swallow tail.
Swallow tail should be about 6" deep.

The plan is a good starting point.

What is hard to see in the plan is the subtle chine that starts at the nose and disappears toward the tail. It starts about the width of a sureform blade and gradually gets narrower.
It is barely 1/16th off of level.
This is an important feature because it keeps the nose from digging in and eases rail to rail transfer.

The common mistake with building Fish boards is too fine of rail in the nose area and or too much edge over all. The 2 Lis boards I still have, only have edge at the swallow tail.

Many Lis boards have a slight single concave that starts about 18" from the nose and gets to be about 1/8" deep under where you'll be sitting, just back of mid way.
There is a slight "V" in the nose starting about 16" back to just a couple inches from the tip.

Go with the keel fins glassed on.
The original ones had them standing perfectly vertical and parallel to the stringer. They were made of marine grade plywood.
My last one I had sent unfinished. I put the fins on with 1/8" tow and 2 degree tilt.
This made it a bit easier to turn. The keel fins are symmetrical foiled (foil on both sides).

If you used FCS plugs with custom keels to fit them you'd ruin the board because the force of the turns would rip them out.

Just go for the full on replica as best you can from these instructions and pictures. I've posted a bunch of the last Lis Fish I had built.
Mine was built for Hawaiian juice and the rails are softened. You could make yours a bit finer for where you surf.

http://www.ksusa.org./Forum/album_showp ... ic_id=1892

You can go vertical with one.
They do turn sharp if you want them to.
album_showpage.php?pic_id=1900
album_showpage.php?pic_id=1901

You just have to get it going......faster you go the easier they turn.
It's a different approach but it's super fun and you won't believe how fast you can go with these things in the right conditions.
Study the pics of guys riding them on the Kneeboard New Zealand site and on mine as well as ones I've posted on this site.

It'll be a great adventure for you and super fun.
Aloha,
Bud

[Marky V]

Thanks Bud
you have just made my day! and have filled in a lot of missing detail, I could see some kind of bevel on the drawing but could not work out dimensions. Have just ordered my blank, Clark 6'9"A as the were out of the 7'3" phil becker until mid July. I figured that they have plenty of thickness and a flatter rocker than the others I have seen. Hope I am on the right track. Can probably change the order if I let them know by monday.
Cheers Marky v

[Bud]

Marky V,

You can use the 62C Clark Kneeboard / Fish blank.
Rich Pavel had a hand in designing it.
It was designed so you can make a Lis Fish from it.
It's thinner than the 69A so you'll not need to take off as much foam.
This keeps the blank stronger as foam cell sturcture is bigger (weaker) towards the core.

The deck needs to be flattened a bit and to get the right bottom rocker you cut off more from the nose end.

Here are the rocker measurement from my 5'8".
(sorry they are in inches not centemeters, it's really early and I dont want to go to my dusty shaping room to get a metric scale just yet)

Starting from the nose:

4" @ tip......1" @ 12"......1/4" @ 24".........0" @ 34" (center)

Starting from the tail:
7/8".......@ the end........3/8" @ 12"........1/8" @ 24"

The rocker gradually curves from nose getting progressively straighter to tail without any dead flat spots.

Your outline should also reflect this gradually straighter curve towards the tail. There are no "hips" on these things.

Have FUN!
Bud

[yogisurf]

I first saw Brockway land El Rollo's at Ab's (Sunset Cliffs, San Diego) in the '70's. Wow! was I impressed. I did them in the same era on my Liss fishes (some copies, some actual's) and mostly landed on my belly. I first did them at Petacalco's and then at Blacks. Since I was landing them on the belly, I did them at the end of wave. Was sore a few times, probably only did 20 or so in my career. Maybe tomorrow at SCSB?

/Yogi

[W.G. Facenda]

I talked to John Brockway about 2months ago.He lived on Maui for about 12 yrs or so and was really into windsurfing . His wife Tina was worldclass also. He windsurfs and snowboards now and said his son is the hottest snowboarder on the hill where he lives (good genes)!We use to surf the ranch in the seventies and el cap and the guy was just so smooth and fast!! Really a classic character and still is having a good time.He had some of the best Lis fishes I have ever ridden . I took one to Kauai with me and got some of the fastest, best surf of my life. I see his friend, Kenny riding his mat at the ranch sometimes ,going really FAST with no noise or even a wake --reminds me of John.

[W.G. Facenda]

I forgot to add he wanted to tell Lee Pattison and Dano Gildea and Hosey that- he his doing REAL GOOD and is busy putting his kids through college but really wanted me to say hi to you guys! So Bud if you see Lee tell him John had a madman laugh in his voice :lol: about Lee Pattison!!!!

[ParkerDavidson]

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[Flexman]

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[ParkerDavidson]

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[Beeline2.0]

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